Re: Mind Bombs for Y2K

Date view Thread view Subject view Author view

From: Dave Winer (
Date: Mon Aug 28 2000 - 11:16:07 PDT

It's a point of view thing. If you want great outlining software, for
example, and no one is willing to produce it at the price you want to pay,
maybe it's time for a re-think. I see the complainers as being inches away
from "getting it", that the reason they don't get the software they want is
their unwillingness to pay for it.

Too bad, because I think there are developers who would like to make the
software, and users that would like to use it, and if they thought about the
real value of the software to them, they might actually get the software
they want.

Outliners are an interesting category because many of the people who use
them are professionals, lawyers, doctors, consultants, etc who make high
five digits, sometimes much more, per year. Anything that improves their
efficiency or quality of work should be worth a few hundred a year, at
least. How much do they pay per year for the phone, for travel and
entertainment. Is an outliner worth the price of a client dinner? $19.95 is
pretty cheap! (McDonald's maybe?)


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Masnick" <>
To: "Dave Winer" <>; <>; "Eirikur
Hallgrimsson" <>
Sent: Monday, August 28, 2000 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: Mind Bombs for Y2K

> At 10:44 PM 8/27/00 -0700, Dave Winer wrote:
> >I opened a discussion group on (InfoDepot is an outliner)
> >so much whining you see there! These people are reallllly cheap, and at
> >same time they bitch about the companies going under. I haven't told
> >people that Radio UserLand is an outliner, because all they would do is
> >present me with infinitely detailed feature lists and then tell me if I
> >all that, they'll pay me $19.95 and want free updates for life. Pardon
> >but what a bunch of cheapskates. Who would want to make software for
> >
> >Dude, the Cluetrain goes both ways. You want the software. Pay for it.
> See, arguments like these confuse me. Maybe I'm crazy, but I actually do
> believe in basic economics, and can see how most markets work. Here's a
> situation where the market has told you how much the software is worth,
> you tell people they're being cheap. They're not. They're being
> and telling you how much they're willing to pay for the software.
> If you don't want to produce the software for the price they're willing to
> pay, then fine, don't produce the software. But, to call your users cheap
> for telling you they won't pay more than they think it's worth seems a bit
> counter productive. If making money is that important to you then figure
> out a way to create offerings (products or services) that your users will
> pay the required price for. Blaming the customers for being cheap
> that you personally believe you can set a more efficient price than the
> market. If that's true, I'm impressed, but I have a hard time believing
> at this point...
> -Mike

Date view Thread view Subject view Author view

This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Mon Aug 28 2000 - 11:24:38 PDT