Re: Debate [RE: Anniversary motto]

John M. Klassa (
Thu, 07 May 1998 13:54:05 -0400

>>>>> On Thu, 7 May 1998, "LW" == Lloyd Wood wrote:

LW> and why not faith in relation to deeds? Why reject karma out of
LW> hand?

Why not? What can you and I do to earn our way into heaven (given that
we appear to define "heaven" a bit differently)?

LW> Only if you agree with Pascal's reasoning in his Wager. Pascal's
LW> main problem there is that he does not attempt to consider the
LW> existence of multiple religions; this requires some recalculation
LW> of the probabilities, and comes out with an answer rather
LW> different to the one he wanted.

...or perhaps he does (attempt to consider the existence of multiple
religions), implicitly, by sweeping them under the rug called

LW> To assume that faith is the necessary component around which all
LW> else must pivot is a distinctly biased viewpoint, but that's
LW> understandable...

+> Christ paid for our sins so that we can enjoy eternal life with
+> Him. Had he not, we'd spend eternity apart from Him. He never
+> promised that we wouldn't have to pay the earthly price for our
+> transgressions against society.

LW> ...given where you're so obviously coming from.

Still, my point is valid. What do murderers who've been saved, and
yet are still executed, have to do with anything? They're paying the
earthly price for their deeds. It's what they receive afterward that
matters (and is where you and I disagree).

LW> The problem is that any obviously sensible religions, where deeds
LW> and intent count far more than faith does, have no marketing ploy
LW> to gain new converts and Spread The Word Further. Hence, the
LW> non-sensible religions (that is, all surviving organised ones)
LW> get to have crusades and fervent jihads thanks to their separate
LW> on- and off-reality accounting systems, and wipe out everything
LW> else. Hmmph.

Eh? Just because someone kills someone in the name of Christianity
doesn't mean that Christ would approve of their actions. There are
lots of misguided people out there (and always have been). The fact
that many people misinterpret faith doesn't mean that the real,
underlying belief system (what you're left with when you get rid of the
misconceptions) is wrong.

LW> Evangelist = evil agent (anagram).

Hmmmmmmm. God = dog (anagram), too. I guess that means that anyone who
believes in God is necessarily, then, a canine worshiper, too.

John Klassa / Alcatel Telecom / Raleigh, NC, USA <><