How can this be justified?

Stephen D. Williams sdw@lig.net
Mon, 01 Oct 2001 15:59:45 -0400


First, one comment about your line below: "I don't know that about my 
own country."  I'm really puzzled.  The US will stand behind any people 
in the US.  Period.  The US will stand behind most other peoples and 
countries that ask and don't have dirty hands.  They even stand behind 
Israel totally, regardless of how extreme (and desperate really) a 
particular action might appear here.  How can you question whether the 
US will stand behind the Jewish people.  Unless the Jewish people become 
totalitarian, imperial, and annexingly militant beyond border scraps, 
the US will always be behind them.

Israel and Palestine (and all of it's neighbors for that matter) need to 
stop fighting.  Period.  The past is no excuse for anyone, however 
survival is a valid concern.  With only glancing understanding of the 
whole mess, I'd suggest some kind of complete monitoring and control 
over who goes where and does what.  Seal the borders, use biometrics, 
whatever until a generation or two goes by and all of this stops.

Alternately, make all regional governments secular with security forces 
actively tracking and locking up any display or action that is 
racist/reglionist or intolerant.  These countries are small enough that 
it would be cheaper to wire the whole place than to keep living with 
these losses and military responses.

I've begun to think that the 'guards' protecting both Israel and 
Palistine should be neutral (UN or US (even though Arabs would question 
US involvement)).

sdw

Tony Berkman wrote:

> I reacted emotionally to your post and mentioned anti-Semitism because 
> of your comment about the only difference being whom the USA supports.  
> For me as a Jew and for many other Jews I am sure, there is a world of 
> difference between the events.  I know that I would not be here today if 
> it were not for Israel and if I ever felt that Israel's existence as a 
> homeland for the Jewish people were in dire straits, I would go there to 
> fight or lend my support in any way possible.
> 
> Of course, I realize that my own views and rationales are colored and 
> shaped by who I am and how I was taught history, whether it be college 
> or Hebrew school, but all the same I feel an incredibly strong alliance 
> to Israel (though I've only visited a handful of times), and I know that 
> all Israel's neighbors, whether "declared" or not are at war with 
> Israel.  Of course it pains me and I feel trouble whenever I read about 
> civilian (or not) Palestinians being killed, however for me, I feel it 
> is in order for my OWN survival.  It is fundamental to the continuance 
> of the Jewish religion.  I know Israel will stand behind the Jewish 
> people.  I don't know that about my own country.
> 
> So I know it would be foolish of me to expect anyone not Jewish to 
> censure a post based on the holiday of Yom Kippur.  After all, as 
> someone pointed out bits are bits and it was after all, printed in the 
> grey lady.  But it wasn't the bits, it was the comment.  You clearly 
> feel Israel is acting wrongly and immoraly, and that just struck a chord 
> in me.  Because in some way my own survival depends upon it.
> 
> 
> At 06:32 PM 9/27/01, you wrote:
> 
>> >          I find this an inappropriate post on Yom Kippur.
>>
>> It was not my intent to take advantage of this holiday -- I will gladly
>> answer replies sent in after today (I will be offline until Monday, 
>> though).
>>
>> > It is one of my great fears that the Jews are somehow going to be 
>> held to
>> > blame in some circles for the tragedies that occurred.
>>
>> I did not make this linkage in my post, intentionally.
>>
>> > I'm not accusing you in any way of being anti-Semitic
>>
>> So why mention it? For the record, I'm not accusing you of being
>> anti-Semitic either.
>>
>> > However, when you mention that the entire
>> > context of the attack doesn't need to be brought to bear, I just 
>> shake my
>> > head.  Of course it does, and the entire context could fill a
>> > library.
>>
>> I believe that "fully considering the context" slowly allows you to 
>> justify
>> horrific acts. If you say, X, though horrific, is justified because A 
>> did Y,
>> and then A justified their terrible actions because B did Z, and so 
>> on, then
>> it only leads to a spiral of violence.
>>
>> - Jim
>>
>>
>>
>> http://xent.com/mailman/listinfo/fork
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://xent.com/mailman/listinfo/fork


-- 
sdw@lig.net  http://sdw.st
Stephen D. Williams
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Dec2000