US war, libertarianism, FoRK, and voices in opposition

Russell Turpin deafbox@hotmail.com
Tue, 30 Apr 2002 02:48:04 +0000


John Hall:
>Defending Western Civilization from the barbarians
>is, I believe, in our strategic interests.

Absolutely. But this isn't going to be some kind
of ragnarok where we kill a sixth of the world
population. Like the war against communism, it
will proceed mostly by converting the enemy, not
by killing them. Undoubtedly, there will be some
real war. But this will be against a background
that pushes for the marketization and secularization
of the Islamic world, through example, through
economic pressure, through international politics,
through popular movements, etc.

It's far from clear that Israel is useful to this
process. To me, Israel looks more like a lightning
rod that focuses and strengthens the most barbaric
elements of the Islamic world, rather than serving
as a buffer against them.

If you're going to be truly, deeply Machiavellian,
you might suggest that Israel is the west's grotesque
nightmare of what it fears, thrown back at the Arab
world. Imagine .. a land overwhelmed by immigrants.
Their purpose to establish a state religion. Over a
century they gain numbers and power. Then cleanse
their territory of those who object. This is both the
fear that motivates those who voted for Le Pen AND
what actually happened in Palestine. "You would do
THIS to us? Ha! See how YOU like it." Of course, no
one expected this from the Islamic world in the  19th
century, when Zionism was started. Britain didn't
support Zionism to get back at the Arabs, but more
because it didn't want to accept Jewish refugees, and
because Zionism appealed to some Christian
millenarianism. If you think that strain is dead,
do a google search on the red heiffer, and imagine
what is going to happen when the Israelis move to
build a temple on the dome.

We need to keep pushing for secular government. Alas,
Islam is not the only religion that would threaten
western civilization in reaching for state power.


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