Padilla and Tribe

carey carey@tstonramp.com
Tue, 11 Jun 2002 12:20:14 -0700


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MessageWhat I love is that we're willing to accept all of this -- =
'assumed guilt', 'assumed ties' and merely based on the fact that he =
-conspired- to make a dirty bomb (alleged).  I have yet to see ANYTHING =
where it says that he actually a) posessed the materials b) had done =
anything more than discuss this or c) warrants being called guilty (!) =
from the getgo.   I have a tiny blog rant on this actually(1), following =
a CNN article that noted among his lost rights as a citizen (he -still- =
is a citizen), is the right of innocence, the right of an attorney and =
the right to not be held reasonably.  =20

ITs great to know that all you have to do is call someone a terrorist =
these days and you can get away with this.=20

And -we- go into other countries and bitch.. go figure.=20


(1) http://livejournal.com/bitbitch/


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Dan Kohn=20
  To: fork@xent.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2002 12:10 PM
  Subject: Padilla and Tribe


  It is shocking that there is not more of an outcry over the unlawful =
detainment of radioactive "dirty bomb" suspect Jose Padilla. Yes, the =
guy is very likely guilty. But so are most other American citizens =
arrested for serious crimes such as murder. Freedom of speech is =
designed to protect objectionable speech, since non-objectionable speech =
doesn't need any protections. Similarly, the due process of law is =
designed to protect individuals who appear guilty but are not. Rumsfeld =
saying that he "was unquestionably involved in terrorist activities" and =
Bush saying that he "is a bad guy" are not good enough reasons to lock =
up Padilla without trial, whether by civilian court or court martial. It =
is especially sad to see liberals such as Tribe imply that national =
security is incompatible with trying Padilla:=20


    "The decision to detain him indefinitely under this new category of =
enemy combatant is intriguing," said Laurence H. Tribe, a law professor =
at Harvard. "It is a source of concern, but the constitutional question =
it presents is deeply perplexing, given that the Constitution is not a =
suicide pact." Pofessor's Tribe's reference to a suicide pact was an =
echo of a similar sentiment in a 1949 dissent by Justice Robert Jackson =
of the Supreme Court [meaning] that the protection of liberty cannot be =
at the expense of the nation's security.
  Spies are regularly tried without intelligence secrets being revealed. =
I believe that within 10 years, these sorts of potentially indefinite =
(and therefore unlawful) detentions will be universally regarded as an =
abrogation of our country's constitutional principles on the scale of =
the Japanese internments in WWII.=20

  --
  Posted by Dan Kohn to Dan Kohn's Blog at 6/11/2002 12:01:24 PM

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  http://www.dankohn.com/blog/
  To subscribe, mailto:dankohn-blog-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Message</TITLE>
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charset=3Diso-8859-1"><BASE=20
href=3Dhttp://www.dankohn.com/blog/>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2716.2200" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY text=3Dblack bgColor=3Dwhite>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>What I love is that we're willing to =
accept all of=20
this -- 'assumed guilt', 'assumed ties' and merely based on the fact =
that he=20
-conspired- to make a dirty bomb (alleged).&nbsp; I have yet to see =
ANYTHING=20
where it says that he actually a) posessed the materials b) had done =
anything=20
more than discuss this or c) warrants being called guilty (!) from the=20
getgo.&nbsp;&nbsp; I have a tiny blog rant on this actually(1), =
following a CNN=20
article that noted among his lost rights as a citizen (he -still- is a =
citizen),=20
is the right of innocence, the right of an attorney and the right to not =
be held=20
reasonably.&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>ITs great to know that all you have to =
do is call=20
someone a terrorist these days and you can get away with this. =
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>And -we- go into other countries and =
bitch.. go=20
figure. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>(1) <A=20
href=3D"http://livejournal.com/bitbitch/">http://livejournal.com/bitbitch=
/</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3Ddan@dankohn.com href=3D"mailto:dan@dankohn.com">Dan =
Kohn</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=3Dfork@xent.com=20
  href=3D"mailto:fork@xent.com">fork@xent.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, June 11, 2002 =
12:10=20
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Padilla and =
Tribe</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2></FONT><BR></DIV>
  <P>It is shocking that there is not more of an outcry over the =
unlawful <A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/06/11/dirty.bomb.suspect/index.html">d=
etainment</A>=20
  of radioactive "dirty bomb" suspect Jose Padilla. Yes, the guy is very =
likely=20
  guilty. But so are most other American citizens arrested for serious =
crimes=20
  such as murder. Freedom of speech is designed to protect objectionable =
speech,=20
  since non-objectionable speech doesn't need any protections. =
Similarly, the=20
  due process of law is designed to protect individuals who appear =
guilty but=20
  are not. Rumsfeld saying that he "was unquestionably involved in =
terrorist=20
  activities" and Bush saying that he "is a bad guy" are not good enough =
reasons=20
  to lock up Padilla without trial, whether by civilian court or court =
martial.=20
  It is especially sad to see liberals such as Tribe imply that national =

  security is incompatible with trying Padilla:=20
  <P>
  <BLOCKQUOTE><I>"The decision to detain him indefinitely under this new =

    category of enemy combatant is intriguing," <A=20
    =
href=3D"http://www.nytimes.com/2002/06/11/national/11LEGA.html">said</A> =

    Laurence H. Tribe, a law professor at Harvard. "It is a source of =
concern,=20
    but the constitutional question it presents is deeply perplexing, =
given that=20
    the Constitution is not a suicide pact." Pofessor's Tribe's =
reference to a=20
    suicide pact was an echo of a similar sentiment in a 1949 dissent by =
Justice=20
    Robert Jackson of the Supreme Court [meaning] that the protection of =
liberty=20
    cannot be at the expense of the nation's =
security.</I></BLOCKQUOTE>Spies are=20
  regularly tried without intelligence secrets being revealed. I believe =
that=20
  within 10 years, these sorts of potentially indefinite (and therefore=20
  unlawful) detentions will be universally regarded as an abrogation of =
our=20
  country's constitutional principles on the scale of the Japanese <A=20
  href=3D"http://oz.net/~cyu/internment/main.html">internments</A> in =
WWII.=20
  <BR><BR>--<BR><FONT color=3Dgray size=3D2>Posted by Dan Kohn to <A=20
  href=3D"http://www.dankohn.com/blog/">Dan Kohn's Blog</A> at 6/11/2002 =
12:01:24=20
  PM</FONT><BR><BR><FONT face=3Dsans-serif color=3Dsilver =
size=3D1>Powered by <A=20
  href=3D"http://pro2.blogger.com"><FONT color=3D#ffcc33>Blogger=20
  Pro</FONT></A></FONT> <BR><TT>--<BR><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.dankohn.com/blog/">http://www.dankohn.com/blog/</A><BR=
>To=20
  subscribe, mailto:dankohn-blog-subscribe@yahoogroups.com<BR>To =
unsubscribe,=20
  mailto:dankohn-blog-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com</TT> =
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