As It Will Be

[Owen Byrne]

I lived in a barrio recently. I believe the pejorative use of the world is
entirely a
North American phenomenon. Not that that proves anything. This was a pretty
good thoughtful response, though, IMHO, and made me feel a little ashamed of
my unrestrained rabble-rousing. Conversation is good.

I've travelled across the midwest US, and I didn't see the diversity you
talk about.
. I did see a striking difference between the Canadian city of Winnipeg and
the American
city of Minneapolis one day's drive away - and that difference was ethnicity
and immigration
 Much more visible in Canada.


> > Even between East and West coasts, the sameness is depressing.
>
> Spoken like someone who never travels the US and not just for business
trips.  I
> continue to be astounded by the variations as I travel from the East, West
and
> more importantly, in the Middle.  There's quite a range.  But for the
folks or
> watching the media or travelling just for trade shows, it must certainly
look
> quite lacking in heterogeniety.  Those who actually experience it know
> otherwise.  Come visit, we could use the tourism boost.
>
> > Heck in all of North America, you have to go the Quebec to find
something a
> little
> > different, or Mexico for a real change of scenery.  Whereas Europe has
> > at least a dozen very different native cultures, plus many "imported"
> > ones.
>
Quebec? The Newfoundlanders are in their boats and headed your way. Y'll
be kissing the cod, b'y, whether you like it or not!


> Again, the ignorance of the untravelled?
>
> > Europe is highly multiethnic, whether the "ugly" groups like it or
> > not.  In my opinion ethnic groups are better integrated here than in
> > the US.  We don't have ghettos or slums with 50% hispanics or
> > whatever.  They just dont exist.  Blacks in Europe have never had
> > anything like the trouble they have had in the US.
>
> And where did the term ghetto originate?  Or barrio?  Wouldn't those
cultural
> abominations have had to come from somewhere?  Oh, right, they're European
> constructs!  Puh-leeze, to say that Europe is better somehow ignores it's
track
> record of over a thousand years trampling on the rights of man.  And the
> emergence of what country helped put a stop to most of that, hmmm?
>
> > Integration problems here are far less trouble than over there, but they
get a
> > much more vociferous treatment from politicians, ugly or otherwise.
>
> I'd wonder how the immigrants lurking near the chunnel would comment here.
Or
> the gypsies in Germany.  To say nothing of the north Africans eager to get
into
> France.  Far less trouble?  No, I don't think so.  Different troubles, of
> course, but less?
>
> > Likewise, security and insecurity are a big issue, but to get a sense
> > of proportion... there are something like 25000 homicides in the US
> > each year, versus a few hundred in France or the UK.  People worry a
> > lot and shout loudly at issues that are relatively minor compared to
> > elsewhere.
>
> You'd think the arrogant Europeans would be glad to see the Americans so
readily
> murdering themselves.  Of course comparisons of one country with a few
million
> residents to that of a country with almost 300 million has other
statistical
> problems.  Proportional still favors the Europeans I suppose.  Perhaps the
fact
> they're all jammed into one place, having tired of their *thousands* of
years
> history murdering each other, has gotten it out of their system.  Let's
hope the
> US reaches that lofty enlightenment a lot sooner.
>
> Let's ask ourselves, what sort of timeline is important here?  Does the
fact
> that the US has managed, in only 200 years, to do what Europe couldn't,
mean
> that the US is somehow better?  I'd argue it doesn't.  It simply means
that
> after thousands of years screwing around the Europeans provided an
effective
> 'bad example' of how not to continue doing things.  So what sorts of
examples
> are being set today that will affect changes for the better 200 years from
now?
> Who's leading that charge?  Is the US the 'effective bad example' this
time
> around?  If so, what's a viable way to effect change?
>

For starters, perhaps if the US put the appointment of Corporate
Surveillance firm out to
tender, or had public hearings, it might help dissipate its
Corporate/Military Behemoth image
I suspect, however, that there's a quid pro quo involved.

Owen