The Grad Student and the Dropout

Russell Turpin deafbox at
Tue Apr 29 22:16:00 PDT 2003

Jeff Bone:
>Does a Singularity itself spawn a demon-haunted world, to the extent that 
>all such demon-haunted worlds can be simulated? Maybe so. ..

Definitely, following Bostrom's argument. Not only
will our intellectual descendants want to simulate
their ancestors, but they also will want to simulate
gods and demons (why not?), who will create subworlds
of beings, who might or might not look like their
ancestors. After all, wouldn't it be strange if we
were the *first* race to reach the singularity? IF
we exist as a simulation, THEN I think it is more
likely that we exist not as a simulation of our
descendants, but of some race we haven't imagined.

>But does that rule out local empiricism?  Not at all. ..

The issue with empiricism isn't that it is ruled
out as a pragmatic tool, but that as a philosophical
position it would no longer serve as a basis for
ruling out an unknowable reality behind the
observable reality, for laughing at the possibility
of demons and gods.

>Empiricism lets you discover the nature of your probability-clustered 
>neighborhood in the phase space, and --- maybe --- even learn things about 
>the macro nature of the phase space at large. ..

That's true in MWI. But in EPW, the phase space is
every possible reality where our reality exists as
a simulation or embedded reality. In THAT phase
space, I think there are many more worlds where we
cannot probe the nature of the Really Real -- or
actually, the Next Reality Up -- than those where
we can. And that's true also for the beings in the
reality behind ours. When you start considering the
hierarchy, the possibilities explode.

MWI is 1950s science-fiction every alternative
world exists parallel to ours. Which is OK and cool
and nothing really to frighten the horses. In
comparison, EPW is really really wierd, as in
Buddhist mystic, Lovecraftian insane wierd. I think
you're trying to tame EPW with analogy from MWI,
and it doesn't really work.

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