[FoRK] U.S. Undocumented Immigrant Numbers Surge

Justin Mason jm at jmason.org
Mon Mar 21 18:03:46 PST 2005

Hash: SHA1

Stephen D. Williams writes:
> The only real reason to restrict immigration is to avoid damaging 
> dilution of the immigree society.  Choosing the filter methods may be 
> fraught with various biases, but trying to absorb a billion people 
> suddenly isn't going to work either.
> You would think that when there are enough people who want to live in 
> the US that they would clean up their own locality to duplicate the US 
> rather than just trying to inherit from our past.  Mexico is the obvious 
> example.  Laws with teeth, systematic purging of corruption, sane 
> infrastructure.  Is it really that difficult?  There are billions 
> waiting to swoop in to build suburbia anywhere that a critical baseline 
> exists.

Who's supposed to do the 'laws with teeth, systematic purging of
corruption, sane infrastructure' part? 

  - The (corrupt) government and its bureaucracy, who are all doing
    quite nicely thank you, without these things interfering with
    their kickback cashflow?  or:

  - The citizens, in an armed revolution or something?

It's quite a big deal removing corruption from a society. bear in mind
it's often not just govt, but the entire social system -- I talked to
people in Nepal who wouldn't deal with banks, for example, due to the
corruption in *that* system.

- --j.

> sdw
> Damien Morton wrote:
> > Adam L Beberg wrote:
> >
> >> Lucas Gonze wrote on 3/21/2005 1:55 PM:
> >>
> >>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005, Adam L Beberg wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Who's them?  Aren't you them just as much as they are?
> >>>
> >>> You're not indigenous, right?
> >>
> >>
> >> But the difference is, my ancestors did it legally via Ellis Island. I'm
> >> pro-immigration, but against open borders. There is a HUGE 
> >> difference. Let anyone with a degree or other mad skillz in I say. 
> >> But keep the 3rd world workers, and more importantly those crappy 
> >> jobs, pollution, and crime, elsewhere.
> >
> >
> > Umm, ignoring for a moment your definition if "indigenous" as anyone 
> > who can trace a line back to any given white settler in the last few 
> > hundred years.
> >
> > Half the great industrialists of the last century had neither degree 
> > nor  measurable "mad skillz", and were as likely as not immigrants or 
> > the children thereof.
> >
> > What, exactly, is the difference between legal and illegal economic 
> > immigration, apart from the legal angle?
> >
> > Economic osmosis is a powerfull and easily understandable force. A 
> > force of nature, you might say.
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