[FoRK] Why AJAX?

Reza B'Far reza
Tue Oct 11 12:50:35 PDT 2005


Hi Gavin:

You're right... There was a time that I thought XForms was going to change
everything... The spec certainly is very promising... but, without support
in IE and Mozilla, XForms is not getting far.

I totally agree with you on more distribution of the computing tasks.  I
personally prefer to push things out to the edge when possible, though there
are arguments on both sides and it ends up being project specific, etc....

I "feel ya" on this though:  Every time there is a little movement in the
software industry, 90% of people run to it and put buzz words on it(panacea
you refer to).  I attribute this to (amongst other reasons):

1)  Most people who're called "Software Engineers" not really being
Engineers at all.  They want some cook-book way of doing things... doesn't
have to be proven in a true engineering rigorous manner... just has to have
a buzz.  Goes back to the youth of the software engineering discipline, the
aftermath of the .COM boom, etc. etc. all this stuff has been beaten to
death on Fork... (BTW: not that "cook-book" is bad... just that most
cook-book stuff in the software industry is BS (IMHO)... very few TRUE
patterns such as those recognized by gang-of-four... Just do a google search
on MVC... there are like a million variations on it... with articles by
every person who every wrote a line of code about how great it is).
2)  Economics of it: people use buzz words to make money (many different
ways, idiots keep their jobs, some folks raise money with buzz words, etc.).

I hate both of these facts, but... well, I think they're facts... and we
have to live with them :-S

Finally, does anyone on the list know why XForms lost momentum?

R

-----Original Message-----
From: fork-bounces at xent.com [mailto:fork-bounces at xent.com]On Behalf Of
Gavin Thomas Nicol
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2005 11:54 AM
To: Fork at Xent.Com
Subject: Re: [FoRK] Why AJAX?



On Oct 11, 2005, at 12:41 AM, Reza B'Far wrote:

> True, but I think XMLHttpRequest just makes it cleaner... I
> actually like to
> use XMLHttpRequest and IFrames, interchangeably or together,
> depending on
> the usage... point being is that applications like data entry suck
> without
> using one/theother/both on the web (well, unless you want an ActiveX,
> Applet, etc. which is a different discussion altogether).

I agree, but people make AJAX sound like a panacea, while (at least
IMHO) it's not. It still requires a great deal of knowledge about
DHTML/DOM/etc. and there are still lot's of useful UI features that
you can't create easily (like pie graphs).

FWIW. I'm more excited about the fact that people are coming to
understand closures etc. as a something applicable to distributed
programming/mobile applications. I often send real JavaScript back
and forth between server and client, rather than just XML/JSON. So
long as you know what you're doing, that can be much more powerful.

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