[FoRK] Baseline for calling out the issue

[Lion Kimbro]

On Dec 2, 2007 5:35 PM, Jeff Bone <jbone at place.org> wrote:
> How many of your principles, Lion, are violated by, let's say, the
> execution of a woman for the crime of being a rape victim?

  I don't have a count of them, but surely, a lot.


> How many of your principles are violated by filling children's heads
> with a hatred of science?

  It is a *sin,* no doubt.


> With religious / political indoctrination of children?

  This gets a pass, because it is automatic.

  Even without trying, it happens.


> How many are violated by people strapping bombs on themselves
> and taking out a restaurant full of men, women, and
> children whose only crime is that they practice a different faith?

  In principal, this violates my principles as well.

  However, this has not happened in recent history--
  The Israel-Palestine conflict is very complicated, and has to do
  with far more than just faith.


> How many of your principles are violated by activists advocating for
> the rights of little clumps of cells over those of real people?

  An interesting question;  I ask myself, "Has that little clump of cells
  formed a nervous system, or not?  Can it suffer?"


> How many of your principles are violated by fanatics who want to punish a
> teacher for allowing her school children to give a stuffed animal a
> particular name?

  Many of the principles are violated.  With execution requested, far more.


> How many of your principles are violated by those
> who threaten death to cartoonists who pen likenesses of certain so-
> called prophets, or who threaten the publishers that publish such
> images?

  Many, Jeff.


>  How many of your principles are violated by those preachers,
> in countless churches across this very country, who every week
> instill in the children of their "flock" utter terror at endless pain
> and torture, should they "stray" from the "path?"

  Many again, Jeff.


> Yeah, those advocating for adopting a harsher stance towards religion
> and the religious, those are the bad guys.  Sure.

  Jeff, there is truth to your criticism.

  My stance has never been that you should not criticize religion.

  But I think you are going beyond *criticizing* religion,
  to out-and-out FATWAH against religion.  I cannot condone
  that.


  I intuit that there is a new religion forming, a new spirituality.

  I think that atheists and religious alike will be part of this new thing
  that is forming, this new shared story of the world.

  In this new story I am seeing starting to emerge, religion is
  cherished and venerated.  In this new story I am seeing grow,
  I see myself in a traditional Christian church, learning about
  science, and how we evolved, and using the break-out rooms to
  write Free Software that helps people see the history of the
  world, as a sacred place, and the source of our lives.  I see
  myself visiting Islamic temples, to hear the story of evolution
  told in their language, about their people's contributions to
  history, and about how the religion evolved and changed
  over time.

  So, criticism of religion as it is now makes sense to me,
  but fatwahs against religion don't make sense to me.

  A great awakening is the vision I really seek, though.